Matt Damon, Casey Affleck, and Hong Chau Talk “The Instigators”

Chau, Affleck, and Damon in The Instigators. / Courtesy AppleTV+

Even if the film weren’t wildly entertaining, Bostonians would thrill to the familiar locations used in Doug Liman’s new movie, The Instigators, starring Matt Damon, Casey Affleck, and Hong Chau. City Hall, Fenway Park, and the Esplanade all make cameos in the heist/buddy comedy, with plot twists and performances showcasing the actors’ (especially Affleck’s) comedic chops. Damon plays Rory, a deadbeat dad whose depression leads him to seek therapy from a psychiatrist played by Chau (an Oscar nominee for her role as the nurse in The Whale). In a desperate bid to put his life back together, Rory signs onto an ill-fated heist with wise-cracking ex-con Cobby (Affleck), and when things go south, they’re forced to take Chau’s character hostage. A throwback to the comedy/thrillers of the ‘70s and ‘80s, Affleck co-wrote the script with City on a Hill creator and executive producer (and former journalist) Chuck MacLean, and it’s guaranteed to keep you both guessing and laughing.

Boston recently spoke via Zoom with the three stars of the movie, which hits theaters Friday, August 2 and begins streaming on Apple TV+ on August 9.

Matt, how many takes were ruined by Casey making you crack up?
Matt Damon: As they used to say, “TMTC”—too many to count. I’m highly unprofessional in situations like that. If I start to get the giggles, it’s a lost cause, and Casey has a habit of rarely saying the same thing twice in a scene. Those little asides and throwaways that he does are like little hand grenades. You keep going on with the scene, and then you realize what he said and it lands with you, and you just kind of go to pieces.

Casey, how much of it was improv?
Casey Affleck: I’d say every day we improvised a little bit, but everyone was doing it, and I think that’s a sign that the whole cast is comfortable with each other and with the director. Doug Liman is really welcoming of that kind of behavior on set. He wanted the whole movie to feel alive and fun, so he said, “Have at it.” Every now and again he’d say, “I don’t like where it’s going. Say one of the things you said before.” And it’s really nice to know that someone is sort of holding the shape of the thing, so that it’s not just a total free-form mess. So, we all felt like we could take risks, because someone was keeping it in bounds.

Hong, you’re not from Boston but you went to BU. Did you ever consider doing a Boston accent, and can you do a Boston accent?
Hong Chau: I’d like to think that I could, but, you know, even within a city, not everybody has the same accent. So, I just thought maybe I’d let these two guys have the accents, and I’ll just stay me.

Matt, Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, or The Sting?
Damon: Oh, my God, come on. Well, I’ll go Butch and Sundance, because I think that’s kind of a perfect screenplay, but that’s a real Sophie’s Choice.

Casey, is this movie a love letter to Boston?
Affleck: Sure, I mean, in some ways. I love Boston. I have so many good memories of growing up here and I love coming back. I really feel like it’s a part of who I am, and so much of what I am outside in the world is because of Boston. But I’d say that maybe more than that, it’s a kind of love letter to friendships, and Boston attitudes.

The Instigators is “kind of love letter to friendships, and Boston attitudes,” Affleck says. / Courtesy Apple+

Hong, would you make a good psychiatrist in real life?
Chau: I think so. Absolutely. I’ve been doing it this whole time. [Laughs]

So, Matt, was George Clooney pissed that he wasn’t let in on this?
Damon: He hasn’t seen it yet, but I’m sure we’ll all get letters.

Casey, have you ever wanted to do—or have you ever done—stand-up?
Affleck: No, I’ve never done it. It seems really, really hard when you watch it. When you watch someone like Dave Chappelle, it looks like he’s just having a conversation. He makes it look easy, and I have a feeling that it’s incredibly difficult, and I haven’t tried it yet. But I’ve done a few wedding speeches and those went well.

Hong, you and Matt have worked together, but how well did you know Casey before the movie, and was it hard to break through their history together?
Chau: No, I hadn’t had the pleasure of working with Casey before. I think we met when I came in for a fitting, and we just kind of chatted. It was so nice to do those scenes with Casey where we got to improvise. I don’t normally improvise that much when I’m doing roles, but with this one, I think because we had so much back and forth, I wanted it to kind of have that bantering quality, like His Girl Friday, where there’s that fun ping-ponging.

Matt, what role did Ben [Affleck] play on this project? I know he’s an executive producer, but how present was he in making this movie?
Damon: Well, he was back minding the store in Los Angeles, because someone’s got to be in the office. But he read all the early drafts, and then, I mean—the way we try to do things is to kind of hire adults to go off and make the film. We try to be as helpful as we can in pre-production, and let them go make the movie. So, Ben was watching cuts and giving notes and ideas, so I’d say it was a very high level of involvement, but he didn’t get to come shoot the movie.

Quincy and Lynn take some licks in this movie. Casey, do you expect any blowback?
Affleck: Nah. I think they’ll be happy to get the mention.

Hong, did you sign on immediately after reading the script?
Chau: I said yes without even reading the script.

Hong, you were so unbelievably moving in The Whale, so I want one of you two to answer: Did she absolutely deserve that Academy Award?
Damon: Look, anytime you get into a conversation about merit, about something that’s totally subjective, it’s just a circular conversation. You know, there are always performances that if you look back 20 or 30 years later, you’re going, “Well, obviously this person was completely robbed.” You could go on forever doing that, and I think in Hong’s case, she just keeps doing amazing work, again and again and again. It’s all different, and it’s all great, and that’s really the only thing you can do. You put everything into what you can control, and don’t worry about the rest.

Affleck, Limon, and Damon on the set of The Instigators. / Courtesy AppleTV+

Casey, was it coincidental that in the movie, there’s a white male incumbent mayor of Boston who gets defeated by an Asian challenger? That’s a little bit of the way it’s gone in real life.
Affleck: You can ask Doug. He cast the movie. But obviously, there were certain nods to the way things have been in Boston and the way things are now. The progress that’s been made. But at the end of the movie, it says none of these characters are based on anyone real, and none of them are. Some are adjacent, or similar.

In writing the script, did you have to resist the urge to write in a lot of references to Dunkin’ Donuts?
Affleck: Aaaah…Yes. [Laughs]

Hong, what’s your favorite thing about Boston?
Chau: Well, speaking of Dunkin’ Donuts, I think the first coffee I ever had was from Dunkins.

Casey, what’s your favorite buddy movie of all time?
Affleck: Oof, that’s a hard question. Obviously, I love The Sting. I’ve watched it with my kids about 30 times, and I once got to work with Robert Redford. I couldn’t resist doing the finger to the nose gesture [from The Sting] to him in a scene, which was bizarre and probably annoying and totally out of place. But Butch Cassidy and Midnight Run and The Three Amigos. I have a lot of favorites.

Were there overt or covert references to other movies in this one, where you kind of slipped something in there that referenced a favorite movie?
Affleck: Totally. And there were moments when we thought, “OK, this is too far.” There were some points where we could easily have said an exact line from one of those movies that we’ve named. And we thought, “We can’t just take the dialogue.” But it’s easy to find those kinds of references.

So, Hong, this was your first wild, comedic caper. Was that something you always had on your wish list, or did it just come out of left field?
Chau: A little out of left field. Maybe I don’t think big enough, but I just didn’t see myself in the action-comedy world. Obviously, Matt being involved made it something that I wanted to do, and I would love to do more.
Damon: And she’s really, really good at it.

OK, Matt, which is closer to who you really are—the hangdog character you play in this movie, or Jason Bourne?
Damon: Well, there’s probably parts of me in both, and then parts that are wildly unlike me in both. This character is in a desperate situation. The fun of the movie is the dynamic between these two guys who get pulled into this heist, and they’re coming from such different places. My character has never committed a crime, and he’s taking notes in the run-up to the heist, because he really just wants to be diligent and get it right. He wants to do this once and never again, so it was a very fun dynamic to try to set up.

Casey, all the plot twists were really clever, and I didn’t see them coming. How does that come about?
Affleck: Through a lot of conversation. I mean, Doug is really the captain of his ship, and he has a very keen understanding of what the audience wants, and what makes a movie work. He’s a master of tone. He knows the difference between a car chase that’s really tense, one that’s really thrilling, and one that’s funny. So, there’s a lot of conversation about those twists and turns, and what the tone is, and how sharp those turns need to be. And I got to learn a lot. For me, it was like an education in how to tell a story.

The locations were incredible, like how you recreated the mayor’s office at City Hall. How much, if any of it, was actually filmed in those places?
Damon: We did film in City Hall. Not in the mayor’s office, but she let us come in and design a set exactly like the office, but we were in the lobby. It was awesome.

The Instigators opens in theaters Friday, August 2.